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Fantastico

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  • ergohost Friend
    June 12, 2009 at 9:20 pm #141891

    Does anyone know offhand if its possible to modify the joomla install files fantastico offers via cpanel.

    Wondering if its possible to alter them to a pre-customised design.

    Thanks.

    hanifahmed Friend
    June 12, 2009 at 11:01 pm #307783

    Depends per cPanel.
    I’m not able to, but I can request the support staff to make changes to them i.e. update them to the latest version etc as soon as I need be (instead of waiting on them).
    If you contact your own host’s support staff, they should be able to tell you.

    ergohost Friend
    June 13, 2009 at 7:27 am #307802

    Thanks for the quick reply. I have the fantastico config set to automatically update to the latest stable release files daily as I dont want to risk any unecessary security problems. Well as up to date as the files Netenberg package anyway. Fanatstico comes under a lot of criticism for hosts not maintaining and updating it regularly so that outdated and vulnerable scripts are being installed by users. This is also one of the reasons I’m wondering if its possible to do.

    I run my own dedicated server and I have full access to everything on the system.

    What I’m considering is customising a joomla layout and modifying the fantastico core files so its the default install via fantastico in a users cpanel. Failing that adding in a few customised templates for users selection.

    Basically I’m wondering if its been done before or if its even possible and it dosent violate any rules laid down by netenberg.

    cjmicro Friend
    June 13, 2009 at 2:14 pm #307817

    I am not sure if this is what you are asking, but I have installed Joomla thru fantastico then updated through my FTP or cpanel without any problem. Cheryl

    ergohost Friend
    June 13, 2009 at 3:41 pm #307819

    <em>@cjmicro 132603 wrote:</em><blockquote>I am not sure if this is what you are asking, but I have installed Joomla thru fantastico then updated through my FTP or cpanel without any problem. Cheryl</blockquote>

    Not really. Thanks for commenting though.

    Basically, I’m looking to take the fantastico files, unpack the jooma files, hopefully rework them to include a site and style I’ve predone or even better multiple styles, repack them and substitute the new site for the default one the fantastico installer provides via a hosting clients cpanel.

    In essense subsituting the standard fantastico joomla install for one of my own reworking.

    cjmicro Friend
    June 13, 2009 at 4:06 pm #307821

    ah! interesting. So you could have like a quickstart version but using fantastico to install. That would be brilliant. Would the hosting provider have to set that up (or you ARE the hosting provider??)

    Cheryl

    ergohost Friend
    June 25, 2009 at 7:17 pm #309105

    I am the hosting provider hoping to try this 🙂

    You would need full root and admin access to the server as far as I can see to access the fantastico files and configuration. I havent had a chance to look into it in any great detail but I will be following the idea up at some point.. Also, if youre a host and you have got fantastico set to auto update packages to the latest release stable (and you should to minimise security risks from those scripts) then there might be a problem with updates overwriting your modifications, dont know enough about the fantastico files to be clear on this yet.

    To do one style install from fantastico would be good, to pick multiple styles to install would be excellent. If fantastico cant be tweaked I’ll look at other ways.

    One other possibility is you can set a default site to be created when you add new accounts to the server via cpanel and whm, I need to look into it in more detail to see if that could include a mysql db, just an idea again I havent checked up on.

    Phill Moderator
    June 25, 2009 at 11:15 pm #309119

    Fantastico sucks. All of the scripts it destroys in its process are so easy to install. If you cannot install a simple script such as Joomla then you should seriously think about running a website.

    I have seen so many sad stories of problems caused by Fantastico it is unreal. As well as it messing around with developers scripts and in some cases damaging their security features in doing so, the installs are often out of date again leaving unsuspecsting users at risk.

    People who use fantastico are also often the sort who just sit back and never learn. Whn things go wrong they are stuffed for that very reason.

    Do yourselves a favour and never touch Fantastico with someone elses barge pole.

    If you ever have a problem with fantastico, please complain to the makers of fantastico. I know of at least 6 open source products that have had problems doing just that. I also know that 3 of these open source developers even tried to help the fantastico people to fix the bugs introduced by their modifications but they were ignored leaving many at risk or in trouble.

    ergohost Friend
    June 29, 2009 at 4:08 am #309382

    <em>@phill luckhurst 134271 wrote:</em><blockquote>Fantastico sucks. All of the scripts it destroys in its process are so easy to install. If you cannot install a simple script such as Joomla then you should seriously think about running a website.

    I have seen so many sad stories of problems caused by Fantastico it is unreal. As well as it messing around with developers scripts and in some cases damaging their security features in doing so, the installs are often out of date again leaving unsuspecsting users at risk.

    People who use fantastico are also often the sort who just sit back and never learn. Whn things go wrong they are stuffed for that very reason.

    Do yourselves a favour and never touch Fantastico with someone elses barge pole.

    If you ever have a problem with fantastico, please complain to the makers of fantastico. I know of at least 6 open source products that have had problems doing just that. I also know that 3 of these open source developers even tried to help the fantastico people to fix the bugs introduced by their modifications but they were ignored leaving many at risk or in trouble.</blockquote>

    Easy there. I understand where youre coming from, but yours is the standpoint of an experienced expert.

    I dont use it, nor do I like it much either, however as a provider of hosting I know people do, and expect it to be a feature of a hosting package, therefore I provide it. And to the contrary everyone has to start somewhere, its not fair to criticise those who are just starting out. Some will never advance past the beginner stage and there are those who as they develop will begin to see the shortcomings of such systems and progress. Everyone has to start somewhere, how did you get started?

    As for out of date at least I run the full cron setup to keep it updated daily, a major failing of many hosts who dont follow the procedure and a significant reason out of date scripts get installed, however that only keeps it as up to date as netenberg do which isnt always keeping up with security advisories. I keep my servers buttoned up pretty tight, and they run a security orientated distro which actually keeps things so tight some of my support problems are actually people not fully understanding why some things dont work without a bit of in depth configuration. I have never had one single security breach incedent.

    I’m merely looking into how it @might@ be possible to better tailor the joomla install aspect.

    What I’d really like is to discover a mature, useable system that lets me run an utomated install fully integrated via whm/cpanel account system, so as well as account types for for the usual package offers users could also pick a preinstalled joomla style based on a packaging system that keeps up to date with the latest joomla stable releases, no small thing lol.

    I’m not having much luck on that hunt so far and doubtful I’ll find something that ticks all the boxes without custom code at a hefty price.

    nefar Friend
    July 14, 2009 at 5:11 pm #311093

    <em>@phill luckhurst 134271 wrote:</em><blockquote>Fantastico sucks. All of the scripts it destroys in its process are so easy to install. If you cannot install a simple script such as Joomla then you should seriously think about running a website.

    I have seen so many sad stories of problems caused by Fantastico it is unreal. As well as it messing around with developers scripts and in some cases damaging their security features in doing so, the installs are often out of date again leaving unsuspecsting users at risk.

    People who use fantastico are also often the sort who just sit back and never learn. Whn things go wrong they are stuffed for that very reason.

    Do yourselves a favour and never touch Fantastico with someone elses barge pole.

    If you ever have a problem with fantastico, please complain to the makers of fantastico. I know of at least 6 open source products that have had problems doing just that. I also know that 3 of these open source developers even tried to help the fantastico people to fix the bugs introduced by their modifications but they were ignored leaving many at risk or in trouble.</blockquote>

    There are many points that I agree with you on with fantastico. However, there are many users out there that are just starting out and to them fantastico is very quick and easy. I look at it more of a baby step. They may install it but in a couple months when something goes wrong or they try and put in an addon and it doesnt’ work with the outdated version fantastico offers they will learn to install themselves or they will pay someone to do it.

    Phill Moderator
    July 14, 2009 at 7:31 pm #311110

    I fully understand that there are users out there who struggle to learn how to use an ftp program and run a simple script but it takes very little effort to learn. I have recently via email only helped a 73yr old guy who had only used a computer for 3 weeks to install Coppermine and set it up to his needs. 2 months later and he is keeping it updated himself.

    Why was he able to learn so quickly? Well IMO it was because he was willing to put in some effort, read the guides and think about what he was doing. The hardest bit fo him was gaining the hand eye co-ordination to use the mouse but he has now mastered that.

    He was a photographer and had just gone digital after 61years using film. So he bought his first PC and now has a website maintained by himself with all the images edited in photoshop by himself. If a man like this can learn to upload and install a php script, anyone can.

    IMHO it is laziness that puts people in the position that they can only be bothered to use one click installs. If you are going to run and maintain a Joomla or Coppermine type website then you really need to learn some basic skills. Compared to actually running a site the install is easy.

    As for Fantastico I know for a fact they have rejected a lot of help offered to them. In one case the developers of a piece of software tried to do everything they could to assist the Fantastico lot but were ignored and even lambasted for attempting to do so. But when problems do arise who do the users turn to? It is always the devs of Joomla etc that get the sharp pointy end.

    Over the last 6 months I have lost count of the number of people I have helped who rely on Fantastico and have been hacked simply because their host offer Fantastico installs that are very out of date.

    Some softwares have gained a bad security reputation as a result but it is plainly not their fault.

    The we have the fact that Fantastico by its very nature has to fiddle with the core code. What then happens when the poor user tries to install a plugin or mod is often quite messy. Again, who do they turn to for help?

    I could go on but this probably explains why I am against it and any installer that messes with the original code, or any installer that makes its users lazy.

    nefar Friend
    July 14, 2009 at 7:38 pm #311111

    <em>@phill luckhurst 136820 wrote:</em><blockquote> I have recently via email only helped a 73yr old guy who had only used a computer for 3 weeks to install Coppermine and set it up to his needs. 2 months later and he is keeping it updated himself.
    </blockquote>

    Good for the old timer! First computer and setting up a web program for the first time at that age is pretty impressive. I’ve never found coppermine to be very newbie friendly either.

    That old time work ethic and willingness to “learn” something new is not as prevalent today. People these days just want it done for them and want it cheap.

    Phill Moderator
    July 14, 2009 at 7:59 pm #311114

    You are right there. What people need is someone to help them through the early stages rather than one click stuff. It is a shame that is not readily available.

    Coppermine is not user friendly but we are working hard on version 1.5 as we speak and the new manual is getting very good. I have spent many hours over the last few weeks going through and correcting the English language files and am currently in the process of reviewing the manual. Hopefully people will take time to read it, a lot of work has gone into it especially from Joachim.

    The new flash uploader is superb too.

    If you want a photo gallery for Joomla there are 2 new bridges in the pipeline. Mehndi has had a bridge for many years but the new one for 1.5 requires no hacks and give full visual integration. The Jfusion team are about to release their bridge for ot too but I have yet to give it a go.

    didima Friend
    July 15, 2009 at 2:04 pm #311178

    some of my sites are been install with fantastico and has been alright but manual isntallation is better and you are in control always.

    ergohost Friend
    July 22, 2009 at 8:29 am #311789

    <em>@phill luckhurst 136825 wrote:</em><blockquote>You are right there. What people need is someone to help them through the early stages rather than one click stuff. It is a shame that is not readily available.

    Coppermine is not user friendly but we are working hard on version 1.5 as we speak and the new manual is getting very good. I have spent many hours over the last few weeks going through and correcting the English language files and am currently in the process of reviewing the manual. Hopefully people will take time to read it, a lot of work has gone into it especially from Joachim.

    The new flash uploader is superb too.

    If you want a photo gallery for Joomla there are 2 new bridges in the pipeline. Mehndi has had a bridge for many years but the new one for 1.5 requires no hacks and give full visual integration. The Jfusion team are about to release their bridge for ot too but I have yet to give it a go.</blockquote>

    Basically I supply Fantastico as some people expect it, but I in no way recommend it, just need to cater to as broad a spectrum of requirements as possible. I do however keep it updated daily.

    I like the sound of the new coppermine, I’m just looking for a good image/media gallery script literally right now for a site. Despite the many offerings for joomla it seems at least from my point of view theres not one thats perfect yet. Theres a few good ones but not ideal.

    The site already utilises jfusion as I needed a way to complement migrating users details as well as a shift from SMF to fireboard before a further shift to kunena (cant find a script so far that will handle direct SMF to Kunena).

    On the subject of attitude, many years ago I worked in a UK biz that dealt in revamping and selling comps. I remember helping this guy out to find and set up a PC for predicting radio satellite availability so he could use HAM radio to talk to his pal in Australia, he was only 93 🙂

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This topic contains 27 replies, has 11 voices, and was last updated by  dheeraj4uuu 14 years, 4 months ago.

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