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[gtrew Friend gtrewJoin date: November 2008Posts: 25Downloads:0Uploads:6 Thanks: 5]

#137178

I’m wondering if some kind folk on this site will help me out. I recently changed my personal website to a Joomlart one, using the Uvite template. Prior to changing sites, I was top of the google ratings re. Graphic Design in my locality. To my horror, my site has disappeared altogether from the google search engine. One of the most frustrating features of this template is that the page title is that which appears on the nav buttons, and I’ve had to put some ugly text on them, in order for a basic title with keywords to appear on the screen. Even though I insert these keywords in a search engine, google doesn’t even find my site. If the worst comes to the worst, I will revert back to my old site, which would be a bit of a blow. I would like to design some Joomla sites for folk, but this SEO issue is making me think that I’d be better off making them Flash sites.

Anyway, some of you guys have obviously circumnavigated this issue, please could you advise me re. this? If I have to insert some code, could you make the instructions as simple as poss.

As well as a manual fix, are there any components or plug-ins out there that you’d recommend to help SEO?

Looking forward to some advice,

My site is http://www.papilloncreative.com

[scotty Friend scottyJoin date: March 2008Posts: 2339Downloads:0Uploads:13 Thanks: 76 Thanked: 827 times in 595 posts]

#286815

I’m sure Mj can give you some very good advice here but from what I know when you change a site the site has to be re-cached and indexed by google so the fact that it’s now a joomla site makes no difference. No matter what you changed it to this would have happened and it can take a while for it to recover.

You can determine what your page title will be by going into the relevant menu and setting it in the parameters. You can also place a set prefix or suffix to your titles (See this post)

gtrew;106521 Even though I insert these keywords in a search engine[/quote] not really sure what you mean by this but I believe submitting URL’s and sitemaps to search engines is regarded as a BAD idea (Mj?).

Or do you mean trying to find your site based on keywords? It just takes time… you have to be patient.

scotty wrote:

I would like to design some Joomla sites for folk, but this SEO issue is making me think that I’d be better off making them Flash sites.

In my expiereince it takes at least 2 weeks for a new site (which is what you have) to be indexed by google. Joomla out of the box does perform well in SERP because it is structured well. SEO is a very complex procedure that takes a lot of trial and error and an awful lot of patience. It is something I really detest having to do.

I presume you are joking about flash.

[mj1256 Friend mj1256Join date: June 2007Posts: 1473Downloads:10Uploads:35 Thanks: 84 Thanked: 225 times in 118 posts]

#286816

this is way too much to teach you in a forum thread

but
go to google and search for your domain
http://www.papilloncreative.com/

it will return in the results so you are indexed.

next, click on the cached link (under and to the right of the site description)
now, there will be a gray box at the top, to the right of that box you will see a link to view the text version of the site
click on text only-version

now you will see what the spiders see, you have no content, all you have is two short paragraphs and the rest are just lists, not a good thing.

Search engine do not give very much weight to keywords in menu systems anymore, and if you are using a script ( as joomla and JA does) the SE’s cannot see the terms anyways

next,
you need to install a third party SEO component like Artio or SH404
I also install a plugin called JoomSEO

you need unique title and meta tags for every page

I also did not see any verification tags for google or yahoo, did you verify your sitemaps with them

the font color on the pages is too lite on the background images, that is bad for SEO, its almost hidden text, you may have a penalty for that

next you need to implement your 301 cannonical redirect www to non-www domain so you can avoid the duplicate site penalty

you need more content, you do know that the meta tags are ignored by google, google only looks at them to see what the theme of the site is about, but if you misuse them, you will be penalized for them

I do SEO for a living, you can accept or reject this if you wish, but your site is not optimized for SEO

1 user says Thank You to mj1256 for this useful post

1. scotty

[scotty Friend scottyJoin date: March 2008Posts: 2339Downloads:0Uploads:13 Thanks: 76 Thanked: 827 times in 595 posts]

#286817

mj1256;106527Click on the cached link (under and to the right of the site description)
now, there will be a gray box at the top, to the right of that box you will see a link to view the text version of the site
click on text only-version

now you will see what the spiders see, you have no content, all you have is two short paragraphs and the rests are just lists, not a good thing

This is a great tip!!

EDIT: OMG!!!! Just checked one of my non joomla site.. this is all Google sees…

Warning: array_key_exists() [function.array-key-exists]: The second argument should be either an array or an object in /home/annsu3/public_html/HIDDEN/includes/functions/sessions.php on line 127

[mj1256 Friend mj1256Join date: June 2007Posts: 1473Downloads:10Uploads:35 Thanks: 84 Thanked: 225 times in 118 posts]

#286821

<blockquote>but from what I know when you change a site the site has to be re-cached and indexed by google so the fact that it’s now a joomla site makes no difference. No matter what you changed it to this would have happened and it can take a while for it to recover.</blockquote>

Scotty is absolutlely correct, you could have a 4 to 6 week lag in rankings as your site is reshuffled in the index. And as the site is a redesign, all the factors that go into the algo for the SE’s is now altered and may not have the same weight you had on your other site.

1 user says Thank You to mj1256 for this useful post

1. gtrew

[mj1256 Friend mj1256Join date: June 2007Posts: 1473Downloads:10Uploads:35 Thanks: 84 Thanked: 225 times in 118 posts]

#286822

<blockquote>not really sure what you mean by this but I believe submitting URL’s and sitemaps to search engines is regarded as a BAD idea (Mj?). </blockquote>

submitting site maps and having them verified is a good idea. Manually submitting your URL is a bad idea, you will do better have a site crawled into an index.

I think the poster was saying that they were doing a keyword search for their site and it was not found

[mj1256 Friend mj1256Join date: June 2007Posts: 1473Downloads:10Uploads:35 Thanks: 84 Thanked: 225 times in 118 posts]

#286823

<blockquote>In my expiereince it takes at least 2 weeks for a new site (which is what you have) to be indexed by google. Joomla out of the box does perform well in SERP because it is structured well. SEO is a very complex procedure that takes a lot of trial and error and an awful lot of patience</blockquote>

Joomla does do fairly well on its own. But you need to realize, it is NOT the site design or the meta tags that get you indexed, its the content and how closely you can meet the search engines algo.

It is an ongoing process of trail and error as all of your competition is also trying to rank their sites against yours. And the person who throws the most money at it, WINS. Search engines ARE NOT a level playing ground where the amateur with no money can compete on the same level as the pro with money.

[scotty Friend scottyJoin date: March 2008Posts: 2339Downloads:0Uploads:13 Thanks: 76 Thanked: 827 times in 595 posts]

#286826

In your opinion Mj, do google ads make a difference to organic rankings? Google say they don’t but I’ve definitely seen a difference and I’ve read others have too.

So if one is to pay for good SERP, where is the best place to spend the money (and still avoid blackhat) ?

[mj1256 Friend mj1256Join date: June 2007Posts: 1473Downloads:10Uploads:35 Thanks: 84 Thanked: 225 times in 118 posts]

#286829

<blockquote>So if one is to pay for good SERP, where is the best place to spend the money</blockquote>

you can send it all to me 🙂

[scotty Friend scottyJoin date: March 2008Posts: 2339Downloads:0Uploads:13 Thanks: 76 Thanked: 827 times in 595 posts]

#286831

LOL! Had a feeling you’d say that. Wasn’t quiet what I meant though.

I’m just looking at another one of my sites and looking at the cached text only version but it’s showing two images. How can this be?

[gtrew Friend gtrewJoin date: November 2008Posts: 25Downloads:0Uploads:6 Thanks: 5]

#286854

Thanks for your prompt reply Scotty.

Very, very helpful info, thanks a bunch.

I was joking re. the Flash, but there again, Flash is much more google friendly these days.

How do you get the Page Title to say what you want it to say, without it appearing on the nav buttons? For example, If I wanted that particular page to say “Graphic and Web Design, Antarctica, Logo and Brochure Design, Siberia, Elephant & Poodle Walking Services….. blah blah,” so that when some dude puts in “Graphic Design Poodle Antarctica” in the search engine, that the page will be recognized by, say, google? How do I do this so as to avoid producing the largest nav button in the history of nav buttons? I basically want the nav button to say one or two things, and the particular page to show an extended form of title.

Does this make sense?

[gtrew Friend gtrewJoin date: November 2008Posts: 25Downloads:0Uploads:6 Thanks: 5]

#286856

Thank you soooo much for the input MJ – it’s really appreciated. SEO to me is like Schrödinger’s equation is to my 11 year old daughter 🙂

The strange thing is that I didn’t seem to do a lot to my previous website in order for it to do well in the rankings, and that’s what I don’t quite understand – a few keywords here, and a bit of meta data there – not really knowing what I was doing. That’s the confusing thing. I will take on board your advice as being 77,000,000,000 in the google ratings won’t do my confidence much good when it comes to designing a couple of sites for folk who want me, for some strange reason, to build them a joomla site.

Try as I might, I can’t get my site verified by Joomlart, never mind google 🙂 I upload the registration number on a txt file, as requested, and it still doesn’t register 🙁

I do have a Google analytics account, but it’s depressing reading at the moment. I tried Google ads, but had no luck there either. Maybe I need to save up a few pennies and invest in someone to do the SEO for me, or at least give me a few lessons on the subject? For now, I will have to try and do it myself.

Thanks again – and any more tips/constructive criticism is most welcome.

[scotty Friend scottyJoin date: March 2008Posts: 2339Downloads:0Uploads:13 Thanks: 76 Thanked: 827 times in 595 posts]

#286880

gtrew;106579How do you get the Page Title to say what you want it to say

1. Click on ‘Menus’
2. Click on ‘Main Menu’ (or whatever one you want to change)
3. Click on ‘Home’ (or whatever one you want to change)
4. Click ‘Parameters (System)’ on the right of the page
5. Change the page title to whatever you want.
6. Click ‘Save’

[scotty Friend scottyJoin date: March 2008Posts: 2339Downloads:0Uploads:13 Thanks: 76 Thanked: 827 times in 595 posts]

#286882

gtrew;106579 For example, If I wanted that particular page to say “Graphic and Web Design, Antarctica, Logo and Brochure Design, Siberia, Elephant & Poodle Walking Services….. blah blah,” so that when some dude puts in “Graphic Design Poodle Antarctica” in the search engine, that the page will be recognized by, say, google?

I know your joking again but just in case….

Page titles should be no longer that 64 characters.

They Should Also Be Structured Like This With First Letter Caps.

Good info here… http://www.seologic.com/faq/title-tags.php

[mj1256 Friend mj1256Join date: June 2007Posts: 1473Downloads:10Uploads:35 Thanks: 84 Thanked: 225 times in 118 posts]

#286884

If you install a third party seo component, the titles would be easy to change

as for your old site being indexed, what were you going for with your keywords
If your the only design firm in East Burrville and that is a keyword, you will be found, and you also will always be found for your domain name, no optimization needed for that at all. If their were 5000 sites selling blue widgets, how would you be the site at the top of the rankings. Also, the websites age is a huge factor in the alg, the older sites will always beat out a newer site.

Flash is not easy to rank as it has no text, google indexes text

Please take no offense to the next statement, just venting
everyone wants me to teach them, and do it in 5 minutes or less, I’ve been doing it for 12 years, I cannot teach 12 years and knowledge in 5 minutes. The next problem is that the area of SEO is so dynamic and the rules change so often, that what I was to teach someone today, will change tomorrow, except the student, who is not keeping up with it, will not know the changes and end up with their site banned, who do you think would get blamed for that?

Do you go to your car mechanic and ask him to teach you how to fix your car?
Do you go to your doctor and ask him to teach you how to be a doctor?
Do you go to your lawyer and ask him to teach you how to be a lawyer?
Do you ask you home builder to teach you how to build a house?
Do you ask your accountant how to do you accounting?

And… would you expect them to teach you all that they know in 5 minutes and less, and have the expectation that you will be a pro with that bit of knowledge.

of course not, but when it comes to SEO, the expectation is that anyone can learn it for themself in 5 minutes or from reading a book.

It is just not true.

The bulk of my work is saving websites that do-it-yourselfers have destroyed because they thought they could do it themself.

The internet is not a level playing field.

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