JoomlArt Forums 32,862 posts

[scarney Friend scarneyJoin date: August 2010Posts: 123Downloads:0Uploads:11 Thanks: 8 Thanked: 5 times in 1 posts]

#171213

I love JA Templates and Extensions and really want to keep using JA for all my web sites. I do have one request that would make life much easier for me, and probably a lot of other people. but, it would be a development effort on your part and could be costly.

I would like some sort of a tool that would allow us to move around positions to modify templates in some sort of graphical interface that would then add the positions to our template and would also somehow add them to the templateDetails.xml declaration file.

What I want to do is something that seems very basic but I have had to pay people on Joomlancers to do the work for me only to find they did not use the overrides and so now I can’t update my templates or JAT3 without having to compare a lot of changes. Ouch.

In a perfect world I would make some position changes to my template and then move modules to the positions (graphically) and then the files would be created within the overrides directories to make my changes. That way I could update the templates using JA Extensions Manager and not have to compare the files since my changes would be in the overrides.

There is a software product out there called Artisteer that is tempting me away from Joomlart because it promises to make it easier to modify templates. The templates are not nearly as nice and the framework is not as nice either. The JA templates are world class but the modifications for me are very cumbersome for me to do myself since I am not a css or a php guru. And, if I hire somebody it can become very costly.

I would love to see you all take a look at Artisteer and see if you could develop some sort of JoomlArt equivalent to make it easier to modify your templates. It seems this should work if a person starts with one of your templates or if they started with the JAT3 blank/basic.

Thank you for considering this idea. I suspect others would love the same thing!

Sean Carney

[scarney Friend scarneyJoin date: August 2010Posts: 123Downloads:0Uploads:11 Thanks: 8 Thanked: 5 times in 1 posts]

#427025

Artisteer is the first but it won’t be the last software to take aim at the template clubs. So, the template clubs need to embrace makiing it easier for people to modify templates. 🙂

[tfosnom Friend tfosnomJoin date: October 2010Posts: 742Downloads:0Uploads:31 Thanks: 145 Thanked: 200 times in 94 posts]

#427056

With Respect, Scarney
Your post raises the question, Do you wish to be a web designer/developer or a push button site master ? To clarify my opinion, are we so living in such a push button, app driven world that not only do we want virtually no involvement (effort, participation) on our behalf to make a killer looking and performing site for next to no financial outlay.

But want to walk in, Press Button A, get the best looking site, Press button B for instant guaranteed top 10 Google SEO. Press Button C. Get instant PPC/Adsense modules tailored to our needs Etc. All without getting up from the breakfast table, perhaps soon we can do it without an internet connection, even 😀 (Press Button Q)

Yes, it would be nice, but I have other dreams that are more likely to happen.

There was a template here that allowed drag and drop positions but I think it was early J. 1.5 only. Artisteer is a joke, MS word approach to Joomla that mixes and matches banners etc but doesn’t have the visual appeal of JA templates, may be ok for some, but IMHO has no guts to it code wise, last trial I tried used a lot of tables I believe.

Just my opinion, many would agree with you and prefer a 1 press button approach to everything web design wise or not. Press Button D. to be bathed, dressed, fed and teleported to your office each day type thing

Shane

[scarney Friend scarneyJoin date: August 2010Posts: 123Downloads:0Uploads:11 Thanks: 8 Thanked: 5 times in 1 posts]

#427177

Shane,

Thank you very much for your replies. You bring up some great points. I would agree that Joomla and JoomlArt is top quality! I also would note that many people are willing to give up some top quality for convenience. To illustrate the point look at what has happend to WordPress in the past three years (explosive growth in CMS market share) and Drupal (holding their own but not growing) and Joomla (declining) 🙁

This is sad to me because I like Joomla. When I started looking at Content Management Systems in the early DOT COM days I hired a crew in India to spend months installing CMS systems and filling in a Matrix of features, useability, etc.. to determine the best CMS. In those days Mambo won out because of it’s usability. It was simply the most intuitive and the best there was. Of course Mambo became Joomla and Joomla has continued to grow. But, the usability did not improve enough and so an inferior platform (WordPress) with superior usability came in and has captured the market. WordPress also came in with ease of upgrades that surpassed Joomla.

Artisteer is like the WordPress of the template world IMHO. They are not going away and they are not going to be without competitors. I would agree that JoomlArt templates are far superior to Artisteer. There is no comparison. But, Artisteer is listening to the needs of people with less technical skills, as did WordPress.

Two years ago I started searching out Templates and Template Clubs looking for the best organization to utilize for all my projects. I am not a developer and I do not want to subscribe to multiple Template Clubs. There were two that were at the top of the list and the very top to me was JoomlArt. They were far better than all the others. That gap is also diminishing. JoomlArt are still awesome templates and the club is great and the support is decent. But, there are competors with nice frameworks, that are working towards having easy to update, easy to modify templates. They are going to start taking a huge piece of market share. If I was to do the same analysis today I may not have settled on JoomlArt. But, I LIKE JoomlArt. I wish them the best. And, that is why I speak up.

I will reply briefly below and do hope that maybe this conversation will be seen by others besides ourselves.

<em>@tfosnom 285778 wrote:</em><blockquote>With Respect, Scarney
Your post raises the question, Do you wish to be a web designer/developer or a push button site master ? </blockquote>

Answer: I do NOT want to be a Designer Developer any more than is absolutely nescessary. I am looking to create our sites as easily and conveniently as possible.

<em>@tfosnom 285778 wrote:</em><blockquote>
To clarify my opinion, are we so living in such a push button, app driven world that not only do we want virtually no involvement (effort, participation) on our behalf to make a killer looking and performing site for next to no financial outlay. </blockquote>

That sounds pretty good to me. The easier the better! 🙂

<em>@tfosnom 285778 wrote:</em><blockquote>
But want to walk in, Press Button A, get the best looking site, Press button B for instant guaranteed top 10 Google SEO. Press Button C. Get instant PPC/Adsense modules tailored to our needs Etc. All without getting up from the breakfast table, perhaps soon we can do it without an internet connection, even 😀 (Press Button Q)
</blockquote>

I know you are being facitious but what you are describing is not too far from the truth. Effectiveness with as little energy expended as possible. I am not fortunate enough to have all kinds of time to do web development. I wish I could do nothing but Joomla but that is not possible for me now.

<em>@tfosnom 285778 wrote:</em><blockquote>
Yes, it would be nice, but I have other dreams that are more likely to happen.Shane</blockquote>

I am sure they are also great ideas. I hope they happen!

<em>@tfosnom 285778 wrote:</em><blockquote>
There was a template here that allowed drag and drop positions but I think it was early J. 1.5 only. Artisteer is a joke, MS word approach to Joomla that mixes and matches banners etc but doesn’t have the visual appeal of JA templates, may be ok for some, but IMHO has no guts to it code wise, last trial I tried used a lot of tables I believe.</blockquote>

I would not laugh off Artisteer too quickly. They are going to improve. That said, I am not ready to go with Artisteer.

<em>@tfosnom 285778 wrote:</em><blockquote>
Just my opinion, many would agree with you and prefer a 1 press button approach to everything web design wise or not. Press Button D. to be bathed, dressed, fed and teleported to your office each day type thing</blockquote>

Well, I am not sure about bathed…. 🙂

Thanks again for your comments. I hope that this wishlist will be monitored and my ideas considered. I also hope you will submit all your ideas. 🙂

Have a great day!

Sean Carney

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